Some welding questions for you...

[colonelk]

Hi all,

well the carlton had its MOT today.... failed of course  But only on 3 things, 2 of which are 5 min jobs, the other a small patch of welding.

Now I have bought myself a welder recently, so Im gonna have a crack at it.... but are there any precautions I should take?

Seem to remember people saying unplug the ECU or battery or something? 

Whats the gen?

Thanks in advance

A Happy Colonel.

[Big Rod]

I assume you're going to use a MIG welder.

Either disconnect the battery or you can buy battery protectors which saves you having to reprogramme your stereo etc when you plug the thing back in. Dunno where you'd get one though! 

You have to make sure the metal you're welding to is absolutely clean and free from rust

Also, make sure there's no wiring or upholstery behind the patch you're welding, 'cos if you don't you can say bye bye to that.

Try and avoid welding near a fuel tank or lines!!

Try to avoid welding near underseal and waxoil type stuff, or at least keep a very close eye on it while you're welding, 'cos that stuff can go up in a hurry!! Useful to keep a fire extinguisher of some description handy.

Sorry, don't mean to sound like the harbinger of doom, but I've done all of the above!! 

[Matt]

I'm no expert, but - what ^ he said.

It needs to be bare metal that you're welding, so get the wire wheel attachment to your angle grinder and clean it as much as you possibly can.

Like anything, preparation is key.

[colonelk]

Thanks guys, I wont take anything as preachy dont worry.... and advice is cool. It is a MIG yeah


Big rod.... carpets? Interior? what are those?! Its stripped so no worries 

Also no stereo to worry about either! 

Good call on the underseal tho.... Ill make sure Ive got my extinguisher handy and a big bucket of water too (note: must switch power off before dosing car in water! LOL)

Ive got a wire wheel for the grinder tooo, so thats no problemo.

[HMK]

That's right, Mark, the above is all correct.

I have three things to hand while I'm welding - like you've just said, a LARGE bucket of water, a CO2 fire extinguisher & very useful - a washing up liquid container, washed out & filled with plain water!! - for a quick squirt at the odd little flame!

I have to admit that I never disconnect batteries or ecu plugs or anything else & I've never had a problem (I must make it clear that on this matter, that although I do it this way, it doesn't mean anyone else should take the risk). The reason that I don't have a problem with things 'blowing' is that I ALWAYS make sure that the earth electrode is clamped to the same relative area (& not much more than 12 inches away from) where I'm welding. So, if I'm welding the exhaust, then the earth clamp will be close by on that same part of the exhaust system - & NOT on part of the bodywork or suspension etc. If I'm welding the body, then the earth clamp will be nearby on a connected part of the same bodywork. The main reason that electrical/electronic parts get damaged is due to spurious voltages/currents (40-60 volts? with induced 'spikes' on) taking an earth return path the long way round through parts that won't stand that sort of abuse. This is caused mainly by people clamping the earth on any old handy bit of bare metal - such as the engine etc. Or, by careless 'flashing' of the live electrode on some unconnected part of the vehicle structure.

Out of interest, which bit have you got to weld?........Sounds like you got away with those bits of rear chassis leg near the springs........(this time ) Well done

[colonelk]

Some more top tips there! Thanks man

Out of interest, which bit have you got to weld?........Sounds like you got away with those bits of rear chassis leg near the springs........(this time ) Well done

yeah got away with it this time.... they will need to be done at somepoint though!

Bit ive got to do it in the passenger footwell.... access is pretty good with the wheel out the way, Im gonna have a crack at patching it tomorrow morning and see how I get on. Being playing on scrap metal tonight and am feeling confident enough I wont blow more holes in the car! 

Good tip on the washing up bottle I like it. I need to get some decent protection mind.... when it spat badly when I got it wrong on the second attempt ever, loads of red hot bits ended up in my hair!  Ouch!

[carlton_mad]

wear an old baseball cap backwards to help protect your head also spot the welds so as not to get the metal too hot tack the corners first and then do in the middle of the sides then to one side of the corners and so on (helps to stop blowing holes) oh and dont for get piccies!!!!!

[mrogers]

Practical Classics Magazine has a great write up on how to be an expert with a mig welder.

[bstardchild]

Practical Classics Magazine has a great write up on how to be an expert with a mig welder.

First copy I've actually bought for ages (maybe years) but it was a good and entertaining read

[colonelk]

Is that this months/weeks practical classics? Ill have to buy a copy.


Now before I show you a picture of my patch and you all fall over laughing, please bear in mine this is only my 3rd attempt at welding ever, my previous experience had totalled less than 5 mins of intermittent welding.

All I need to know is this..... is it MOT standard?



Havent undersealed it obviously in case it needs more or whatever.... theres a mixture of ground back and new welds there.... I have done all the way round but it does look quite spotty.

Feel free to take the piss.... as long as the MOT q is answered!

[mapblue]

Looking at your picture there i would say you need to turn down your wire speed a bit and that should stop it sparking.

As for your mot it must be seam welded all the way around with no holes,If you use a bit of seam sealer  before you paint it he wont know.

Hope your wiring looms OK as its very close to where you are welding had to weld my one in the same place,Good luck on the retest.

[carlton_mad]

personally i wouldnt be able to pass that looking at the pics it looks like a no-gas welder was used (not the best or the easiest to use)but if you finish it all off you should be ok try grinding it all back and then you can see where youve missed

[colonelk]

Ok thanks for the advice chaps. Will have another crack....



Wiring loom has been held out the way

[Pedro]

No need for me to add owt - all been covered!

Skweezy bottle? I have my very old and trusty water pistol! 

Better aim, you see.............

[colonelk]

righty, ground it back, had another go.... ground it back again.

Theres a couple of bits I think need more work... any opinions? getting better? LOL



Cheers for everyone being patient and putting up with me on this 

[Big Rod]

Not the tidiest by any manner of means, but that'll pass easy.

(Particularly if you cover it with underseal first)

[Scatmancraig]

I am reading this post with particluar interest as i am contemplating having a go at welding my Monza myself, mainly to cut down costs, but also so i can teach myself to weld! 

On a related subject, what cort of money can i be expecting to pay for a welder which is good for the diy inexperience welder, assuming i was to buy it new???

[colonelk]

BTW whats best to cover it with?

Seam sealer or plain old underseal?

Scatman.... Ive just started with no instruction, gonna go see if I can get hold of this magazine for tips and see how we go from there. Im fully aware my welding skills are comical right now.... hope I can improve! May see if I can find a short course or something. I bought mine from Machinemart I think, as Ive had bad experiences borrowing old ones before (ie, they never worked! LOL)

[Big Rod]

I am reading this post with particluar interest as i am contemplating having a go at welding my Monza myself, mainly to cut down costs, but also so i can teach myself to weld! 

On a related subject, what cort of money can i be expecting to pay for a welder which is good for the diy inexperience welder, assuming i was to buy it new???

Buy a decent one like a Clarke or a MigMate. I bought a budget one and regretted it!!

If you're going to be doing a lot of welding indoors, get one with a big refillable gas bottle, that'll save you money in the long run, because those little disposable bottles you get are hopeless, not to mention expensive.

It's dead easy and very enjoyable once you get the hang of it. I could happily weld all day!!

[carlton_mad]

buy a clarke gas mig mine is a pro 90 and works a treat have used it to build/modify exhausts repaired my estate with it too blinding little tool!!!!!!!!! especially if you dont use the mask! lolol

[colonelk]

Carlton Mad.... any opinions on the second pic matey? Id appreciate your input

[carlton_mad]

much better seam seal it now and then give her a coat of hammerite then underseal over that and shell be a good un !!

[colonelk]

Schweeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeet. Cheers man!

[Pedro]

I can't be doing with those gasless things! Total garbage IMHO!

OK, so you need to befriend an Al Murray (Pub Landlord) for your CO2, but it's worth it in the end, especially if you're gonna do quite a bit of welding.

Also, try and get the highest output you can - it's better for the machine to tickover and you getting good results, rather than being thrashed all the time..........

[carlton_mad]

shouldnt that be imeo? (in my expert opinion) pete?